UCF11 Celsior v JZS147 Aristo

[infotechplus]

This article is on the Toymods Forum:

UCF11 Celsior v JZS147 Aristo comparison article

It's a write-up by Mr.1JZ, and is a thoughtful comparison of the two cars. It might be worth a read to get someone else's impressions of the 147, compared to another model Lexus.

Here's the direct link:

http://www.toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=15100

Cheers,

Peter
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1996 Aristo JZS147 Series 2

[JayVee]

[Import Monster]

[JayVee]

[Andypants]

I can't get access, even after I registered?? Whats up with that
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I'm very responsible, when ever something goes wrong they always say I'm responsible.

[infotechplus]

Sorry guys, didn't realise it was such a trauma.

Here's the article in full:

UCF11 Celsior v JZS147 Aristo Comparison

Overview

UCF11 Celsior
When released in 1990 these were the flagship of the Toyota/Lexus fleet and they were delivered to Australia by Lexus as the Lexus LS400 and priced at around 100-120K they were aimed at being the S class and 7 Series killer. Powered by a revolutionary 191kw 4.0 litre quad cam all alloy V8 known as the 1UZ-FE. All of these cars were released in auto guise with an A341E 4 Speed gearbox. The Japanese versions of these cars also came with optional height adjustable airbag suspension denoted by the UCF-11 the extra 1 as the last number in the code denotes height adjustable airbag suspension. Also these cars came in 4 spec levels A, B, C and CF spec. The A and B spec cars are rarely seen in Australia as many people did not want to import cars without airbag suspension as it was a large draw card. The C and CF were more common as they all came with airbag suspension as an option and had different interior trim levels. Leather was an option on both cars but the CF is fitted with rear controls that allow back seat passengers to have the use of the radio controls, vibrating rear seats and heated rear seats also.

JZS147 Aristo
Released in 1991 in Japan and aimed at the buyer who wanted the Grand Tourer sedan with enough power to get you out of a sticky situation quickly or more than enough to get you into one. These cars came in 3 variants with an options list as long as my arm. The 3 variants were basically separated by engine choice and drive to the wheels. They came with a 2JZGE, 2JZGTE or 4WD 1UZFE and were all automatic. Leather was an option on all three variants as was a sunroof and LSD. Although they have only recently become eligible for import they are proving to be quite a popular vehicle with the 2JZGTE 3.0 V model being the most popular choice for most buyers seeing as you can get anything factory 2JZGTE powered for under 20 grand these days.

Engines and Gearboxes:
In stock form both of these cars are hard to pick that they are even running as is the trademark with the silky smooth motors that Toyota generally fits to their flagship models and when choosing between the two you have to decide if you want the V8 burble or making the car go quite fast is your aim. With the Aristo you have the 2JZGTE power plant, highly regarded as one of the best inline sixes to ever come from Japan and has awesome power potential with very minimal modifications. 250rwkw on stock turbos has been seen before and is more than possible. However if ultimate power is not your goal then you might prefer the silky smooth V8 found in the Celsiors, renowned for making smooth linear power and enough torque to pull down a house the 1UZ is a surprisingly economical (for a V and bullet proof motor (6 bolt mains), and the sound...with just a cat back exhaust it can make anyone have shivers run down their spines.

The gearboxes in both cars are much of a muchness and I couldn pick any differences between them apart from the one behind the Celsior shifting a little harder than the Aristo, but that would be most likely due to the fact that one car is 6 years younger than the other with my Aristo being a 1996 model compared to the Celsior which is a 1990 model. Both are fitted with the A341LE automatic gearbox and there are a host of aftermarket shift kit options for the gearbox, with MV automatics offering its Stage 1 kit all the way through to the Stage 3 kit with manual shift box and bigger stall convertor.

Interior:
It is weird for me to appreciate the interior of a car because normally I'm ripping it out to make way for a roll cage and a bucket seat...but this is the daily driver...got to have the creature comforts. When you get into either of these cars it's very difficult to tell the difference between them, obviously there are differences but they are quite similar still, even with 6 years of difference. It's good to see Toyota have worked out the LCD screen issue that was rife among the Celsiors and repaired that too. Both cars seat 4 people very comfortably and 5 not so comfortably but it wouldn't be too bad with 3 little kids on the back seat I suppose. The velour in both cars has maintained its condition quite well and still remains to be quite comfortable. Electric front drivers and passenger seats are also quite nice. If you were going to make the choice on either a Celsior or an Aristo based on the interior then it is going to be a very hard task to do so because they are nearly identical in quality and spec

Sound System:
I felt that this deserved its own category, normally I'm not a person who cares much about the sound system in a car. Both of these cars being luxury cruisers then the sound system is as equally important as being able to look awesome on the road. Here the Aristo is the hands down winner with possibly one of the best factory sound systems in a car under $50,000 retail I have ever heard, the clarity and bass is amazing and it absolutely shits all over the Celsior for quality. The Aristo also has an 11 speaker system where the Celsior only has a 7 speaker system. The only thing the Celsior has over the Aristo in this department is the fact it is equipped with a 6 stack CD player as opposed to the Aristo's single CD system. The only thing I will be changing on my Aristo in regards to sound system is the fitment of an in dash TV player as the cd reader on my Aristo sometimes skips over bumps.

Suspension:
One of the larger differences between the two cars and can be one of the major deal breakers when deciding on which one to go for, the Aristo is fitted with a conventional double wishbone setup very similar to a JZA80 supra and as such can be made to handle a lot easier than the Celsior can be, but this factor depends on what a potential buyer wants the car for. As when cutting laps or cruising down the esplanade handling is not as important as looking cool. The airbag suspension fitted to the Celsiors can be modified to go quite low or quite high with the use of a $200 height controlled and the advantages of this are very plain to see. Unfortunately this airbag suspension as its getting a little long in the tooth and it is quite expensive to fix if there is an issue with it, when it is working though it's a fantastic item to have on the car and I do wish that my Aristo was fitted with it. If height adjustment is something you are after though many companies do make coilovers for the Aristo's and HSD will be releasing something soon for them I have been told.

Brakes:
The Aristo takes the cake here in this department, even though both cars are fitted with the pedal controlled handbrake the front brakes on the Aristo seem to stop the car far better than the Celsior ones do, I could not find official data on the Aristo but i believe they are 298mm Twin Piston front calipers and they really do stop on a dime, both my Celsior and Aristo are fitted with Bendix ultimate front pads and even though the Celsior is fitted with similar sized rotors and calipers and does stop quite well it just doesn't seem to have the same stopping power as the Aristo. Also the Aristo is fitted with an electronic brake booster which can be odd to feel vibrating through your brake pedal I am told it is less susceptible to hydraulic failure. Time will tell on this matter though as due to it being electrical it will be quite expensive to replace if it does fail.

Exterior/Aesthetics:
This category is all a matter of personal taste, stock for stock I believe the Celsior is a nicer looking car, it is not fair to compare the looks of my green Celsior and my silver Aristo because the Aristo is lowered and has a set of 18" wheels on it. But as with any big luxury Toyota they are not hard to be made to look good. With just wheels and lowering the Aristo becomes a better looking car in my opinion and this also has a lot to do with the "WTF" factor of the car, a factor that a Celsior does not have due to the high volume of them that came into the country under the 15 year rule and the fact they came here as an Australian delivered vehicle through Lexus. Both of the vehicles have factory option kits, on the Celsior it is in the form of a subtle front lip, with the Aristo it is in the form of the odd rear spoiler and slightly different front bar. IMO the Aristo needs the rear spoiler to complete the rear otherwise it looks kind of odd, but as has been proven with this, the rear spoiler is all a matter of personal taste as to whether it looks good or not...I believe it looks good but not good enough hence why I will be replacing it with a junction produce boot lid spoiler. Also the front lights on the Aristo suffer from the same issue that JZA80 Supras suffer from in that they go a yellowy tinge, this can easily be fixed by using some Honda plastic cleaner on the outside.

Safety Features:
Both of these vehicles are fitted with the usual common Toyota safety features such as ABS, Traction Control and Driver Side Airbags, after 1995 there was a small update on the Aristo that made passenger side airbags standard also.

Overall Comments:
Overall these cars are similarly priced with similar km's, Celsiors seem to average around 100-170km's and AristoÃÔ can be anywhere from 50-150kms. I would be going for the Aristo every day of the week that choice to me is made because I like to own powerful cars, and to make the Celsior powerful involves spending thousands on cams and throttles and a decent exhaust or a forced induction conversion such as a supercharger or a pair of turbos. With the Aristo it's already there and ready to be tapped into.
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1996 Aristo JZS147 Series 2

[infotechplus]

[JayVee]

[infotechplus]

There are two types of membership:

There is Forum Membership, which allows you to browse all the threads except the Member's Rides.

And there's Toymods Car Club, of which I am a member, which gives you full access to Forums, Club Merchandise, etc.

The only restriction is you have to have about 30 'reputation points; to post in the For Sale section.

The administration of the club is all by volunteers but I have to agree that it can be a bit slow at times.

But for technical help on anything Toyota it's the best place to look - there's a lot of people on there with a wealth of knowledge and practical experience.

Cheers,

Peter
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1996 Aristo JZS147 Series 2

[sbyder]

toymods used to be good. Now its full of assholes trying as hard as possible to show themselves as being better than someone else, hence they had to put certain measures in place to try and prevent such people from easily accessing the site. Sux for the rest of the polulation though....
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Your local Brisbane Compliance Contact
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....Website coming soon....

[Andypants]

Thanks for the Article Peter,

Was a great read.
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I'm very responsible, when ever something goes wrong they always say I'm responsible.

[Miggy]

I'm a member but never post, many of the guys on there know ALLOT about there Toyota's and they would just call me an idiot if I posted anything on there hahaha also a really good place to see weird and crazy conversions involving toyoÃÔ
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Aristo 454hp @ 22psi / C20 350 chev pickup / AE92 corolla

[SS DIS]

i have owned both vehicles and you can not compare the 2.

if you want a sporty 4 door go the aristo
if you want a crusiser then go the celsior.

If i had my choice id have my 1st celsior back in a hurry over the aristo.

was one of the best cars i have ever owned.
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VIPstyle may start out innocently enough..... But once you discover the depth of the hobby you've started. Its practically never ending

[Bigma]

by a 1uz powered aristo and confuse everyone

[Dave Toyostar]

I was driving a 1UZ Aristo for a few days while I was in Japan, very nice car and a bit different to the Twn Turbo model. Much like a Celsior just without all the extras still had airbag suspension etc.
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Regards
Dave Toyostar

[christodav]

I read this article a while ago. It isn't a bad write-up......a few mistakes but not bad. Thanks Peter for posting it up.

Chris

[Aristo]

[infotechplus]

I find that truly amazing!

Worst still, I can't for the life of me think why they would do that.

I'd offer to help you but I know how frustrating it can be trying to get information from the administration side of the club. I paid my membership fee and I only received the membership card and other goodies eg. polo shirt when I turned up to a Dyno Day many, many months later.

Needless to say I lost my card that same day and it still hasn't been replaced since last July I think it was.

Sorry to hear of your troubles (and those others who have attempted to join.

It's not an "exclusive" club by any means but it appears to be going that way from what you say.

Cheers,

Peter
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1996 Aristo JZS147 Series 2